Very good start so far. We still have to remember that we have played teams that have more or less "come to get one point". Especially Swansea were really defencive. Having said that what has improved from last season is that when we are winning by one goal we are not defending too much (like last season).

Also Miki is finally giving some end product. He was good in the first game and ok in the second. Those two assist against Swansea were sweet!

I had my doubts for Matic but seems like a perfect fit for the team.

It will be interesting to see when we will face the top 6 sides will we change our tactics to more like when playing counter attacks in the last two games ie having Matic and Fellaini as DCs and Pogba as a ACM.

The good thing is that even though these were weaker teams, then last season such games were our problem. Doing well in those is important as most of the points come from games against the 'bottom 13' in the league.

What do you guys think about the eventual re-signing of Ibrahimovic?

As I am concerned, this might be OK only in case of a particular contract type, where the player would be paid based on the number of games played.
Moreover, he would need to accept a role on the bench.

Anyway, I'd rather if we bought a player like Jovetic for the reserve option in attack.
He is a proven striker who can play also as a number 10, he is 27 years old, already played in EPL, a nice guy with good discipline and work rate.
Inter Milan want just 13mil euro for him, so imo it would be a bargain and a good buy overall.
Just an idea, but tbh I'd like this more than re-signing Zlatan.

I'm certain that Ibra hasn't got too many guarantees as he's coming back from a terrible injury. Also, there's hardly any player aged 30+ in the world I'd rather have in my offense than him.

He pretty much singlehandidly give us hope last season. Now we've added Lukaku.

I'm expecting miracles by now. :-)

Maybe Mourinho is planning to use Zlatan as a plan B option, to put him near Lukaku as a 2nd striker when we are chasing the result, something that until now he often used Fellaini for.

Of course, apart from that, he would use him in games where Lukaku is rested or unavailable.

Anyway, I am not sure it would be a good idea to bring him back. Last year it made sense, but now it might not be the best possible solution.

Don't underestimate the power of having a winner in the locker room.

Just see the difference from Sir Alex to not Sir Alex. Imo, he did a lot of wrongs, but he was a winner and he HATED losing.

Ibra is the same and for that reason alone, he's worth a pay check, even if he just plays 5 games. He can make the others understand how freaking terrible it is not to win.

Lamba wrote:

Don't underestimate the power of having a winner in the locker room.

Just see the difference from Sir Alex to not Sir Alex. Imo, he did a lot of wrongs, but he was a winner and he HATED losing.

Ibra is the same and for that reason alone, he's worth a pay check, even if he just plays 5 games. He can make the others understand how freaking terrible it is not to win.

That was very important last season, in a period of transition.

Now, it seems that we have a great atmosphere in the dressing room, a good group and those guys are winners even without Zlatan.

He is too big as a personality and imo not made for a bench role.

Dunno, I just feel that this season his presence might be more cumbersome than helpful.

Anyway, I'd rather if we bought a player like Jovetic for the reserve option in attack.
He is a proven striker who can play also as a number 10, he is 27 years old, already played in EPL, a nice guy with good discipline and work rate.
Inter Milan want just 13mil euro for him, so imo it would be a bargain and a good buy overall.
Just an idea, but tbh I'd like this more than re-signing Zlatan.

Why should we ever want a 27yo injury-prone player? I think he just wouldn't be good enough. For the number 10 position we already have Mata, Miki and also Pogba. For the forwards position we have 3 players - Lukaku, Rashford and Martial. Jovetic isn't better than any of them IMO. He also doesn't have the potential to become great any more IMO. When City signed him he had the potential to be great, now.. not any more.

Zlatan on the other hand - he is a top quality player. I mean - even at the age of 35 he scored more goals in a season than Jovetic ever has. I don't see any reason why he shouldn't score at a similar rate(probably playing much less than last season but scoring a goal every other game). He also brings the right attitude to the team. He is a winner and probably a leader in the dressing room. We don't have too many of those around nowadays, although I think that Jose has brought in a few and that's getting better.

For me the strategy for buying someone should be either a top quality proven player or a talent. So far Jose has brought player who fill one or both of the categories. Zlatan is one of the best strikers of the current era.

I feel that resigning Zlatan is a no-brainer. He knows he won't start every game when he is back fit as we have other top quality options in the squad as well. I think he is versatile as well and could play behind Lukaku centrally(he has been a number 10 for Sweden for quite a while) and be great there.

I think he is one of those who will play until he is 40 and have a big influence even at that age. I'm quite sure that Zlatan will continue for a few more years unless he gets more bad injuries. And I think it's likely he'll stay at United for more than this one year.


Also as a sidenote - if United were to be interested in Jovetic, then the price would automatically double. The premium for English clubs is there as everyone knows there's a lot of money in PL.

Nemanja77 wrote:

Lamba wrote:

Don't underestimate the power of having a winner in the locker room.

Just see the difference from Sir Alex to not Sir Alex. Imo, he did a lot of wrongs, but he was a winner and he HATED losing.

Ibra is the same and for that reason alone, he's worth a pay check, even if he just plays 5 games. He can make the others understand how freaking terrible it is not to win.

That was very important last season, in a period of transition.

Now, it seems that we have a great atmosphere in the dressing room, a good group and those guys are winners even without Zlatan.

He is too big as a personality and imo not made for a bench role.

Dunno, I just feel that this season his presence might be more cumbersome than helpful.

I think Zlatan has been around the dressing room even this summer and has contributed to the atmosphere there.

I think he is smart and won't be petulant when not starting. I'm quite sure that Jose has thought about this and talked to Zlatan about it as well.

I think you are underestimating Jovetic, who has proven to be a great player also on the international level. The only club where he didn't really succeed is City, as they didn't really handle him well and didn't give him enough opportunities.

Anyway, we are talking about a bench player, a reserve option.

For me, Ibra is not a player for the bench, despite his age.

His character is too big for that and might even be counter-productive for our dressing room and team spirit, which at the moment seems excellent and doesn't need to be "fixed" in any way.

Said that, I don't think we need a leader like Zlatan now (especially not from the bench) as we already have a group of experienced players who are used to winning, like Carrick, Valencia, De Gea, Herrera, Mata, Matic, etc.
Also the younger ones like Lukaku, Rashford, Martial, Bailly, Pogba all seem pretty self-confident.

If we re-sign Ibrahimovic, I am afraid José is going to start playing him in the first 11 again and I wouldn't really like that, as we are currently looking very well.

Then again, if he does accept a reserve role, if he can come back completely fit and if his presence doesn't affect our dressing room in any negative way, then I will be pleased to have a player of Zlatan's calibre on the bench.

I think your worries are unfounded. I think you're underestimating Zlatan. I don't think he is the type of a person who doesn't see the big picture of the team.

I also don't think it would be bad if we played a 4-4-2ish formation with Zlatan behind Lukaku. Zlatan is a creator as well as a scorer and someone who can play the 'Fellaini role' of breaking the opponents press by controlling the longer balls. I think you're underestimating his importance in the buildup phase of our game.

I think Jose will find a way to use him in the team. If Lukaku continues to score like has has scored so far then Zlatan won't get many games as a number 9. But if for some weird reason he starts to struggle, then we have Zlatan to put there and show Lukaku how it's done. Or if Lukaku should get injured. Or needs a rest, which he inevitably will need.

I think you are underestimating Jovetic, who has proven to be a great player also on the international level. The only club where he didn't really succeed is City, as they didn't really handle him well and didn't give him enough opportunities.

(https://www.whoscored.com/Players/29072/Histo...vetic)

Looking at this, one thing especially pops out - he is injured so often. The last 3 seasons(since leaving City) he's only played 2942 minutes. That's about the same amount as Phil Jones in the same period. Other than that I guess his contribution is good, even though I feel he isn't an imposing player. A bit like Mata in the sense that Mata won't dominate matches but will somehow score and assist nevertheless. If we were to buy a 27yo player, then for me he'd have to be great. If we buy a 27yo injury prone player, then he'd have to be like Robben. Otherwise it's just like with Phil Jones - you can't count on him but you don't want to sell him either because you know that if he gets back fit he is good enough for United.

As for bringing in the international level - I think that's more of a sidenote than something to take seriously. Looking at who he has scored against in internationals then it's mainly against small countries. The biggest countries being Sweden, Denmark and the likes.

we already have a group of experienced players who are used to winning, like Carrick, Valencia, De Gea, Herrera, Mata, Matic, etc.
Also the younger ones like Lukaku, Rashford, Martial, Bailly, Pogba all seem pretty self-confident.

Out of these players, only Pogba has the kind of personality to drive the rest of the locker room. I respect Carrick a lot, but he's a very quiet and reserved individual and despite his excellent achievements with the club he isn't cut for leading the line [kinda like Scholes, brilliant player but certainly not fit for captaincy]. Valencia is about the same [i think he does speak English though, only not good enough to feel confident around the media which is fair enough imho]. De Gea certainly doesn't strike me as someone with leadership qualities. Herrera does have leadership qualities, but he's slotted in as an "experienced player who is used to winning" which beyond his last year and couple of months [so I'm including LVG's FA Cup] he didn't have, or at least certainly not enough to say that he's in any way comparable to Ibra. Mata has more experience of winning but he's a big softie and not the person to lead a locker room as much as I like the guy. Matic is more in line with what you say, but the guy's just arrived. Rashford and Martial are no leaders despite being confident. Lukaku maybe, but he needs some time with the squad before claiming he's central to the locker room.

My point is that Ibra's resigning is a good thing. No fee was paid for him, his salary is most likely lower [not like United really cares about that], he's a proven performer and has a very good relationship with Mourinho. Also having someone with his personality in the team is a gift because it's an extremely rare combination of traits those that he has. Most importantly it seems that Ibra's personality rubs off well on Pogba et co, kinda like Cantona's rubbed off on the whole squad back in the '90s. And we all know how highly the Class of 92 rated Cantona's importance in their developlent. Choosing a second-rate player like Jovetic instead would offer only downsides when compared to Ibrahimovic's importance.

chuksi wrote:

I think your worries are unfounded. I think you're underestimating Zlatan. I don't think he is the type of a person who doesn't see the big picture of the team.

Exactly.

His "I am Zlatan. I'm the king of the world. I'm greater and bigger than any team" is a "figure" that's built up more than Sir Alex and Mourinho's huge personalities in the press.

I've never heard anything bad about Zlatan since his early 20's about attitude, personality or anything else from his clubs. Sometimes, you just create something bigger to take the blame (like Ferguson ALWAYS took all the attention, not because he didn't care about his players, but because they were left alone to focus on playing then).

I'm a HUGE fan of signing talents like Martial, Depay, etc. and develop them in our amazing setup, but getting Zlatan (back), even at this age, is like striking gold.

So - we got Benfica, Basel and CSKA in the CL draw. In all fairness we should win those games.

I hope the game in Moscow is as early as possible, because the weather in December can be pretty damn bad there.

Otherwise the opponents are among the weakest in each group. Should give Jose a chance to rotate quite a bit and that should help our league campaign.

Benfica is also a good chance to see some of the top talent in Portugal. :-)

Well.. they sold Ederson, Semedo and Lindelöf this summer. So perhaps the best talents there were picked up this summer and they've spent just 4m of that money so far. It seems like they're just not so good this season.

Portuguese top teams, like Ajax, tend to uncover gems by the dozen. The real task is figuring out which of the gems are worth anything. ;-)

Lamba wrote:

Portuguese top teams, like Ajax, tend to uncover gems by the dozen. The real task is figuring out which of the gems are worth anything. ;-)

Eh? ;)

(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AFC_Ajax)

I'm in favour of re-signing Ibra if he's to be used in the way everyone here thinks he will. Trouble is, I'm not sure that's accurate. Jose is very loyal to his people, and Ibra is #1 on his people list. I can see Jose using Ibra over Lukaku, which I would find troubling.

So we'll see.